The following exchange occurred after the Hughes advised Jodi to move on because not only was Travis emotionally unavailable, he had a history of being abusive to women. (Note that this exchange takes place only four months after Travis and Jodi first meet.)
From: Travis Alexander
To: C. S. Hughes, Sky Hughes
Date Wed, 29 Jan 2007 2:27 pm
Subject: You’ve crossed the line
Chris and Sky,
I just got off the phone with a very reluctant to talk to me Jodi. In fact, so reluctant she doesn’t want me to write you guys because of her great fear that you will not have any respect for her if you find out. She mentioned that she was instructed to not email or call me, and to erase me from her myspace and act if I do not exist. She also mentioned that the last 3 days have been a discourse on how I am a jerk. I am abusive to women and that she is blind to the type of person I really am. I didn’t pry for a lot of details because it was obvious that Jodi wasn’t comfortable in telling me much in fear of upsetting the 2 of you as she already feels she has. She mentioned that a comment was made that if she continued to associate with me that you both would lose all respect for her. She also mentioned that you were continually calling her Deanna. To some it up the past 3 days you were beating in her head that I am a broken person that is F’d up in the head who needs counciling, that I am extremely abusive to women and the fact that she in interested in me proves that she has her own head problems and needs counciling too. What I find ironic is that your whole basis for all this I am assuming is so that I don’t hurt her. What is also ironic, is that Jodi and I have never had an argument, not one. We have always got along and enjoyed each others company. Have I ever been rude to her. Well I am sure I have simply because I am rough around the edges and make a joke that isn’t funny but sounded funny at the time. Never have I said any thing in anger and if you ask Jodi I would bet that she could easily count on one hand with fingers to spare how many times I have offended her. Now if that makes me the devil I would ask you the same question that Sky asked Jodi. Has he ever even once been a jerk to you. Jodi’s answer was yes. Now if you don’t have the same answer to the question, then congrats you are better than me and everyone else for that matter. I think that it is a very manipulative question to ask and to try to base a point on a positive answer to the question has Travis ever in his life acted like a jerk. In fact the whole 3 day experience sounds like a grand brain washing. What I seriously don’t get is if you are so concerned about Jodi’s feelings did you ever consider what it might do to her feelings when she was a number of times referred to as Deanna, told that your respect for her is contingent on her disowning one of her best friends and the person that introduced her to the church, calling her blind and that she needs counciling. How do you think that effects her feelings. I have never ever heard Jodi cry, not once until I talked to her a few moments ago and all it I heard was tears and fear. Next time you want to throw me under the bus and there is no denying that that happened quite a bit remember the advice of the secret to not focus on a anti Travis compaign but more of pro someone else campaign. It would save Jodi and my own feelings a great deal of hurt. That may have been the Doctor Laura approach but it is not the Jesus Christ approach.
Which brings me to my next thoughts , my feelings. The very little that Jodi would tell me was plenty for me to be reminded of an incite that you had about Jason Rae. I will para-phrase the best I can. “If you are so against the type of people we are, don’t act like we are friends”. If you really thing that I am such a horrible person to women why would you want to associate with me and consider me a friend. If I am a bad person to women, than I am simply a bad person. Feeling like you can be my friend and tell Jodi to drop me like a dirty diaper is not consistent. If I am not good enough to be her friend why am I good enough to be yours. You have always been the epitome to kind to me and excellent friends, in fact unconditional friends, that’s why this approach is so confusing to me. I guess what I am getting at is that I am very hurt by the comments made about me. I think they were unfair, dramatically exaggerated and most importantly not your place to say. I realize everything was said with a righteous motive. However it was over zealous and in appropriate. I feel you shot beyond the mark. Now in most cases I would first ask from some clarity, but I think we can all agree that they don’t get more honest than Jodi. Now if you meant things to come off that way or not it doesn’t matter, what I have written is a very mild version of how it did come off. In my opinion you over stepped your bounds and caused way more problems than you solved. I know you were trying to help but you went over board.
Which brings me to my next thought. Regardless of what you may think, I am not mean to Jodi. I adore Jodi. In fact I don’t know if it has ever been easier to be nice to someone as it is with Jodi. Has a little of the imperfect Travis came out around Jodi. The answer is you better believe it, but the key word is a little and I don’t think that by any realistic standard can you deem my behavior with Jodi anywhere in the neighborhood of mean. So much so that I can’t believe I feel the need to defend myself on the matter. The next issue is her waiting around for me forever. Hence the name of Deanna being used in vain. Let me point out that I have known Jodi 4 months. I went from intrigued by her to interested in her to caring about her deeply to realizing how lucky I would be to have her as part of my life forever. That has all happened in 4 months. I would say that is pretty normal. I don’t feel that our courtship has been one of her waiting around and wasting her life. Let me reemphasize 4 months ago we didn’t know the other existed. I am scrambling and worrying and receiving extremely intense outside pressure from so many sources to fix myself that I am about to have a nervous break down. I realize what I will lose or more accurately have lost a great person in Jodi, I realize how amazing Jodi is. I am aware of my fear of commitment, I think as Jim Rohn would say I have made measurable progress in a reasonable amount of time. At least as far as my relationship with Jodi is concerned. Does that mean I expect Jodi to wait around for 4 more months or 4 more years so I can figure it all out? No. My selfish side wants her to wait around but I know its not fair to her and believe it or not I do care enough to put someone including a girl above my own selfish desires. My point is this I am trying and it hasn’t been a very long time and it certainly hasn’t been so long that you feel you should be justified to intervene and tell her to never speak to me again. How long did you know each other before you made the big decisions. I realize that every situation is different but that is my point. Regardless of the situation 4 months is not a long time. It makes me wonder who you think I should marry. We have had so many conversations about me needing to get married, but than you tell Jodi that I am mean and abusive and a jerk. I suppose you told her that because you like her and you care for her. So who should I marry then? Someone not as good as her. Someone you don’t like or would not have the potential to care about, someone that sucks so bad that she deserves to be abused and wait around indefinitely. If I am as bad as you have depicted me to be then you really believe that I shouldn’t be marrying anybody. So my question to you is am I that bad of a person, or just not good enough for the likes of Jodi? What you have accomplished is irreparable damage to mine and Jodi’s relationship. She is paranoid that this evil person you have depicted will someday surface. No matter what I say or do she will always have in the back of her mind of this person that lurks in the shadows. She told me “I haven’t seen any of what they said about you but they know you will enough to know that is who you really are. Why would they say that if it wasn’t true. So in other words I am atoning for sins that I have not committed. She respects your opinion so much that you did about as much damage to our relationship with your comments as if I would have by back handing her across her face myself. 3 days ago she thought I was a great guy. Tonight she said that I was “someone with major character flaws” she just hasn’t experienced the severity of them yet. How do you think that made me feel about my good friends Chris and Sky Hughes. Guys I am sorry but while I am trying desperately to overcome my problems so that I don’t lose something great like I have done before. You are kicking me while I am down and ruining any chance that I had. It is one thing if she decides I am not the one based on who I am or what I have done but this is ridiculous. Your remarks have become part of the problem and not the solution. How with such a endorsement am I ever supposed to get married. Before I forget why I on earth would you recommend her to date a Non-member who has already asked her to throw the Church a side so they could have a relationship. That has got to be the most ridiculous thing of it all. Am I so bad that a border line and Mormon is better. Against my own desires I have recommend that she go date other good members so that she could at least see a contrast from me but a Non member. I just don’t get it.
Guys I hope I am making an Ass of myself and missing some key factor that makes everything you said appropriate but I am not finding it. What is for certain is you have done your own fair share of hurting Jodi. She loves and respects you so much that she doesn’t want to mention anything to you but on the other hand she is not interested in having a Travis Alexander Roast ever again. I would like to think that I have enough redeeming qualities that you wouldn’t have to spend 3 days inflating my imperfections. The only thing I ask of you is that you would both take the time to apologize to Jodi and do what you can to make her feel comfortable that this incident wont cause any weird moments between you guys and her. She is terrified of losing your friendship or even diminishing it in any way. She loves you as much as you love her and probably even more. As for me you probably don’t feel you owe me an apology so I wont ask for one. If you feel inclined to reply back on all of this I would ask that you address every part of this email so that nothing is left unresolved. Your friendship is also very important to me. I love both so much. Which is probably why your poor opinion of me hurt me. I usually can give a crap. I am fully aware that some people don’t like me, but I don’t care what most people think. I do however care what the 2 of you think. I know everything that went on was meant with good intentions but that is not what occurred. You will have to forgive my sternness. I am just very upset. I don’t know who said what and I only know very little of what was said. What I do know is most of it shouldn’t have been said. My name apparently is not safe in your home. I know you are aware of my problems but I didn’t think they were so big to be violently opposed against me. I realize that how you meant things is way different then how they were perceived. I know you are loving people who want the best for Jodi and I. I think sometimes we just get carried away and desensitized when something is the topic of conversation for a long period of time. I know being chided by someone of the likes of me is probably not easy to take because I am the one usually being chided but I ask you to respect what is written not the writer. Jodi has so much respect and admiration for your entire family. She has told me that she wants to format her family after yours. She thinks that you are going to think she is stupid either vocally or silently and it will never be the same. That can’t happen. It would crush her. So please do your best to make her feel comfortable around you is my only request. I don’t even ask for an apology, just don’t send me a rebuttal putting me in my place because I already know my faults clearly and honestly . It would only upset me.
P.S. After I wrote this I slept on it reread it and edited it and describe how I felt when I wasn’t angry. So please take this in the spirit it was sent. I love you both very much.
From: Sky Hughes
To: Travis Alexander
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 3:35 pm
Subject Re: You’ve crossed the line
I know this is a conversation that needs to happen over the phone, and Chris wants to call you, but will have to later because we have a doctor’s appointment and he doesn’t want to rush (he may be writing you now). I do much better writing. So I am going to respond via e-mail, I only have 15 minutes, so I won’t be able to address everything now, but I wanted to say some things promptly, and if you want me to address the rest, let me know, as I would be more than happy to. First and foremost, you are a wonderful person and we love you (even if it seems that we don’t). We are excited for you to get married, and want you to be happy. I knew you would be upset and hurt, and you have every right to be – you should be. I was going to write you an e-mail Saturday night, but it was too late, and then I was going to yesterday, but assumed you would be writing, and wanted you to be able to say everything you wanted to say without any distractions from me. I am sorry for all of this, I would have rather not been put in this situation, but that’s what happens when you care about two people that are involved and I am ok with that. I don’t know if this makes sense, but with the information she gave me, the advice I gave Jodi, was not the friend thing to do (in regards to our friendship, mine and yours), but I felt that it was the right thing to do.
I can only imagine all of the pain you are in/have been in over your situation with Deanna, and I know this situation with Jodi doesn’t help. Know that I would love to see you marry Jodi, but just because you have never heard her cry, doesn’t mean she hasn’t been crying. She LOVES you, so much that she is afraid that bringing up anything that is bothering her or letting you know that she doesn’t think you are “perfect” would ruin all chances to be with you. When she explains her CURRENT situation with you to her friends, we are not the only ones that have told her to “move on.” Everyone she has explained it to, has given her the same advice. Since it was us, it enabled her to tell you how she TRULY feels without it coming directly from her, but from people who care about you.
Let me sum up the situation:
Your sister is in love with a guy that loves someone else. He can’t be honest with those he cares most about, about his feelings for her. In fact, he won’t even allow her to put pictures up of the two of them in places where “people” may see them. He doesn’t call her during the day, he waits until after 1am (giving her what is left of him at the end of every day). He jokingly calls her a skank. He tells her to go out with other guys, but makes her feel guilty when she does. Thus keeping control, without having to give any commitment. He kisses her in the dark, when no one is around, and messes around with her, but won’t commit to her. People that know both of them have no idea they are even an “item”. She loves him more than anything, and will do anything for him, and just wants that mirrored, but it is nowhere in sight because he is not available. She feels insecure about where she stands with him most of the time, too afraid to be honest with him. And again, he is not available.
WHAT DO YOU TELL YOUR SISTER TO DO?
Move on right?
Are we so wrong for advising her to do the same?
I have to go, but look forward to talking to you about this later, and Jodi should know I wouldn’t “lose” respect for her. I thought I made it clear that even if she changes nothing we love her just the same.
I will send her a copy of this.
Love ya! (even though you hate me)
From: C.S. Hughes
To: Travis Alexander
Date Wed, 31 Jan 2007 1:24 pm
Subject: My sincere appologies
You’re a stud dude, that’s all I gotta say. SKY IS SOOOOOOOO FREAKING IMPRESSED WITH YOU!
I know this was uncomfortable for a season, but guarantee all things will be better as a result of this. It was almost like a BIG ZIT that needed to be popped AHHHHH : ) I love ya man!! I hope you come into town for the APT and you better freakin stay here and get your grove on with Jodi : )
From: Sky Hughes
To: Travis Alexander
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 3:48 pm
Subject: My Response
I will respond in all caps, not cuz I am mad, but cuz it will be easier to differentiate where I responded.
I knew Jodi would go to you with everything I said (I don’t say that in a bad way), or I would not have said it. In fact, I had hoped she would because that would open the gate to discuss why I said what I did, which would allow it to come from me, and not her, and she could tell you how she feels. I’ve been in this situation. It is a self esteem thing. It is easier to say they said this, cuz it doesn’t “rock the boat” between you two, but her concerns are addressed without her being “demanding” or a “jerk”. Knowing this, I hope you can see that this was not about ripping you up, it was about her being upset with where she is in this relationship. In love with you, seeing a future, but being a booty call. (Again, we were looking at actions, not words). The capitalization really comes across as firm/yelling … make sure you don’t read it this way.
* * * * * I will start my responses with these stars. Continually – no. Chris used it as an example that she needs to get change, or she would be in the same boat. I know with the emotions you are feeling, and trying to do what you need to with Deanna, this was like a slap in the face, but to me it is a way of describing Jodi’s undying love for you, in hopes of change, with no change in sight.
* * * * * I would not have gotten this from it. It was not like that. If it had been where we kept bringing up what a jerk you were and trying to force her to feeling this, I would recommend NEVER speaking to us again. The reality is, she would sadly and torn up, tell us things and I would tell her what I wished I had done in the same situation. It wasn’t about you. It was that she should not allow you to hurt her anymore. It was advice from one girl to another about things you were doing. When she told me what you were saying, I did say, “That isn’t right. It’s abusive. He is not nice to girls. He is mean, and if he is talking to you like this now, it would be worse when you get married, and you have kids to think about. You wouldn’t want your daughter to be with someone that talks to her like this, nor makes her feel like this.” And I still think this is true. Had you joked about Josh calling me a skank, fine. Probably not right, but I would laugh. BUT, I am also not in love with you. That would hurt her a lot more than me. You said you wanted to be refined. This is how that works. It means giving up parts of you, that are ok to give up. You may feel, “That’s me, if she doesn’t like me – I’m not gonna be someone else.” That’s not you, that’s the T-DOGG. Travis said he wants to get married and be refined. So I hope this doesn’t offend you. When I write this out, it sounds worse than when it came out of my mouth. When spoken, it was spoken with concern, not anger (I did get upset towards the end (not with Jodi), but I will explain at the end of this letter).
* * * * * I am really sorry this happened the way it did, but if you want me to respond to this point by point, I have to take you to that night, so my responses are not going to sound apologetic. I will respond with the logic in my head that night. I’ve been trying to be nice because I feel bad, but it doesn’t give you an explanation to what happened. The whole “basis” was so you didn’t KEEP hurting her, so she wouldn’t let you keep hurting her and be ok with it. Trav, she was in pain. I think the pain with Jodi you experienced wasn’t what we caused, but it was the same pain we saw that night. We caused her to go to you with the pain, but we didn’t cause the pain. I simply validated her pain. She was being treated horribly, you weren’t beating her physically, but you were emotionally. Granted you may not have recognized it, but it is about time you do. When you are in love with someone, and they supposedly care about you, but you aren’t acknowledged as an important part of their life unless the door is closed and you are making out … Or on the phone when no one else can hear … that does something to your self-worth. She had been making excuses for you “we aren’t officially together” etc. “so I can’t expect certain things.” She was very hurt. Especially, when people you both know, when trying to figure out if there were anything between you, after watching you, told her, “After watching the two of you, we decided by the body language nothing was going on.” She mentioned this SEVERAL times, so it was obviously upsetting her. The days of making out with girls having little meaning ended when you hit about 25, Travis! Especially when coupled with talk of wanting to get married. Jodi is not in love with me, therefore, I do not have the ability to cause the pain you saw. I saw the same pain, and knew, just as you did, this is screwed up! (There is a lot I am leaving out, but it would take days.)
* * * * * Again Travis, WE didn’t cause the pain you saw. She felt like an idiot. She said, “You guys aren’t going to respect me.” That was her own fear. I reassured her throughout the conversation that I loved her, and that wouldn’t change. But it wasn’t right for you to do what you were doing – making out with her, but not giving her the commitment that she deserves. You have her total commitment, and that is why you are ok with the situation. Or, were ok with it. I never said she should disown you. My whole thing, that I kept reiterating, was, “We love Travis, and we love you. But, he is not available, and who knows how long it is going to take for him to get over Deanna. He is not giving you what you deserve, but he is taking a lot. Move on, and he will either realize what he had, fix himself, and come for you when he is ready, or he won’t. But either way you will be better off. He will either be there, available, for you down the road, or he won’t. But don’t destroy your self-worth in the process.” She didn’t feel like she could make demands on you, so instead of staying in the “relationship” the way it was and getting hurt, building up animosity, and causing permanent long term damage, I advised her to move on. Not necessarily with her feelings for you, those aren’t going to disappear, but physically go out and have fun – without the guilt.
* * * * * I know Jodi told you more than a little, and I’m glad she did. Travis, with love, you are a heart predator. You take great joy in making women fall for the T-dogg. You laugh about what you can get away with. It would scare me to death if my little sister liked you, in fact, I wouldn’t allow it. I am a bad person in a lot of ways, doesn’t mean you aren’t gonna be my friend (well maybe not, after this incident). Women are fragile, and you have shattered a lot of them. It is possible that the reason it came off so badly is because it was charged with so much pain that Jodi has been going through? And not necessarily because what we were saying was so terrible? Let me try to clarify. What was going on in her head, and what was going on in our house were totally different. For example, she tells us that you call after one, and she thinks to call you all the time. You are often so tired and seem like you are forcing yourself to stay awake. She wished you would just call her cuz you want to say hi, or because you were thinking about her. Her excitement about you is not mirrored. I tell her she deserves more than that. In a new relationship one is excited, you MAKE time to call that person just to say hi. You make out with her everytime you see her. You keep her up late at night. You owe her more than what you are giving her. She has given you everything, all control, and you give her 3am calls and make-out-fests. I tell her this, and it is what she has been feeling. She asked why? I told her that she is filling the physical spot that Deanna doesn’t. But Deanna fulfills everything else for you. That is not to say you don’t enjoy talking to Jodi. But with Deanna fulfilling all but physical needs, and with Jodi fulfilling the physical, you feel fulfilled. This is not terrible to say, it is true. I told her if she wanted more from you, she needed to make you earn what she is offering so freely, otherwise she is going to stay very confused and hurt. When he is willing to love you the way you need and deserved to be loved, than you won’t feel the pain and confusion you do now. He has no right to make out with you, make you feel guilty about hanging out with guys (by teasing her you do this), call you so he can check it off his list (that’s how she feels), and not commit to you (Not at 29, and always talking about being ready to get married. Making out with someone now means different things than it used to, or at least it should). Now, to me that is not horrible to say, it’s simply true. I would think you would give someone the same advice. And you may feel that you give her a lot more than that, BUT SHE DOESN’T, and SHE needs to. It’s not to say you are a horrible person, just taking a lot from her without giving much (I am not saying you FORCE her to love you, but she does). And I told her you aren’t available to give her what she wants right now. In her head, her whole reality has just changed and not because I put it there. She had been feeling a lot of what we said and expressed that to us, but didn’t want it to be true. We didn’t create anything/”brainwash her” we just let her know she is feeling exactly how she should be. She had been making excuses for why it was ok that you were doing the things you were, and making her so sad. I didn’t fillet you, but what she had hoped “was” with you, wasn’t, and her excuses were filleted. I wish you could have been a fly on the wall, you still would have been upset, but probably more-so because you would have agreed with us.
* * * * * Have you treated her better than girls in the past? Yes. And I said that. But that doesn’t mean you haven’t been mean. She has been hurt …. A lot. And you have made her cry, and I really feel it was not what we did that upset her so much. It was the reality that she loved a person whose actions were not in accordance with how she had hoped he felt. I do feel it is mean to talk about wanting to get married, making out with a person every time you see her, but when she walks into a room full of people, you don’t stop everything to run give her a hug and a warm hello. I saw this at my house. It took too much time for you to even acknowledge her arrival … It was mean, but I don’t think you were trying to be mean. NO ONE even knows there is anything going on with you guys..! Unless they have stayed at our house and have seen you go in the same room. This is sad for her. She can’t even say to guys that ask her out, or in conversation that she is seeing Travis Alexander (unless it is John Dixon). Call it what you want, but this secrecy says more to her in the way it makes her feel than anything. You don’t want people to know, and whatever your reasons for that are, it is what it is, and that is mean. I know who Sean Mikael is making out with at night because I see him and how he acts with her during the day, same with Jesse McPherson, and I don’t even know these guys that well. I know who you are making out with at night, but I have no idea what is going on with you during the day. Jodi is an awesome girl, and whoever she is making out with should be proud to let EVERYONE know. It should show in his relationship with her in public. If you care about her, don’t keep it a secret – for her sake. This causes her a lot of pain, and I told her she doesn’t deserve it. You are being a jerk. This is what I said, and this is how I feel. I know you have crap you are dealing with, and I feel for you Trav, I really do, But don’t put Jodi through emotional turmoil so she can relate better to you. It is unnecessary damage that can be prevented.
* * * * * I told her you have no reason to be better for her if the relationship continued the way it was. And had all of this not happened, that would be true. There were no ripples in the water before, but Jodi was also suffering silently. I’m sure that made your end of it easier (not the suffering), but that things were easier with you two because she had no expectations. You had everything you wanted, but she didn’t, and still doesn’t. 4 months is plenty of time to figure out if you want to pursue something. You have to commit to her if you really want to figure out if she is the one for you it’s just how it is. It’s called a relationship. You will have to date her and just her, without any back up plans, lds singles, and flirting. With what she has given, and taking into consideration what she is willing to give you, she needs more from you, or she needs to change courses. How long would she wait for you to get over Deanna? I’m guessing a long time … Being hurt along the way. How long should she wait, she will have to figure that out. I just hope she keeps her self-worth while waiting.
* * * * * Trav, know that everyone needs to fix themselves. It’s a part of life. It is ok to admit you have been affected by your upbringing. I fear you are so set at saying you are ok with it all that you can’t get over some things. Using it as an excuse, and being affected by it, are two totally different things. To say you weren’t affected by it is insane. A child’s brain develops differently in those situations. Different chemicals and different structure. You are so afraid of appearing weak or damaged, that you can’t admit that you have been hurt, and hurt badly by your parents. The great thing is, we have a loving Father in Heaven, and our Brother has provided a way for us to overcome all things. Release the pressure and start dealing with it! You are an incredible person, and when you take into consideration what you have been through, you are a miracle. It is unfathomable how you turned out to be the wonderful person you are today.
* * * * * You have not lost Jodi, and you know that. In fact, I think she loves you more than ever. A lot of her doubts and fears have been laid to rest because you have been forced by your looser friends to really tell her how much you care about her. She, hopefully long term, is going to expect to be treated better, and expect more from you. I never told her to never speak to you again. I told her move on. I knew she would see you and she would talk to you – even if she cut you off completely (which she would never even consider). Just FYI, we are a bad example. Between our first kiss and our deciding to get married, it was like a week, max 2. And yes, he is that good of a kisser. Just FYI Trav, I had major issues about getting married (especially to Chris). My head wasn’t right – like yours. And you may have just have to faith it. Let God tell you what to do. I was never, “Oh, I can’t live without you.” Before we got married, but I am now. My sisters were all about the emotions, and I would rather trust God than my own emotions. I know God told me to marry Chris, despite my head issues, and I just did it. And my sisters question whether they made the right choice, but I KNOW I did. And knowing is much more comforting when Chris is causing all sorts of issues : ) (that’s a joke), than feelings that come and go.
* * * * * From what I know of Jodi, I would take away your free-agency, and make you marry her today. I want you guys to get married, and that is part of why I told her to move on until you are the guy you need to be for her. It wasn’t good for her to be confused and sad the way she was, not for long term success. You’re not bad, you are just being a jerk to her! She deserves more of you, and you won’t/ can’t give it to her, so she needs to move on! I love you and Jodi together. You are sooooo opposite. You compliment each other very nicely. You wanted to be made a better, and I have never seen you with anyone that can do that better than Jodi, nor have I ever met anyone that I would put you with more than Jodi. Chris and I have talked about, “What/who is Travis going to marry? I couldn’t come up with the person/personality, until Jodi. I have often thought that she has got to be a little crazy just because she seems way too perfect. She is sooooo soft, and soooo kind, and so mellow …You two balance each other more than any couple I have ever seen. She is hippy, and you are pooring paint in the gutter . . Did I mention there was a little kid laying the gutter that you had just tripped, and you were pooring the paint on him? I don’t want to ruin things by being a little too enthusiastic, but I really would be thrilled if you two got married, but you would have to be MMMMMUUUUUCCCCCHHHHHH more sensitive with her than you are now. BUT, the bottom line is, you are not available. And there is no telling when you will be, and that is really sad. I want what Jodi wants, and I was upset to hear from her (by her concerns), that you weren’t treating her how you should be. Like her, but obviously not to the extent, I was really bummed at how you were treating her because that’s not congruent with how we hoped it would be. You have one shot for the “how we fell in love story.” I was fluffy, Chris was a conceited toothpick – we hear it all the time. It would suck for her to have to go through this and have it continue, “I loved Travis, but was never good enough for him. He kept me a secret, he couldn’t commit to me because I wasn’t good enough, and he didn’t care about me enugh to let Deanna go.” She needs and deserves a better story and so do you. Although if you do get married, the ‘My best friends told her to kick me to the curb.” Is pretty interesting.
* * * * * This was about my earlier comments that you were mean to girls. She did say this to us. I think she was/is scared to let you know how insecure/hurt she is. I totally understand it because I have been there. You feel like a freaking idiot! Because what you are essentially saying if you bring it up, is “Why don’t you like me more?” and you feel like if you bring it up, they won’t be changing because they like you, but because you made them. It’s just really uncomfortable cuz you feel like you are making demands that you can’t. You aren’t “a couple” so she can’t expect you to act that way. It is my opinion that if you are going to be making out with her etc. you owe her respect ie a commitment. And it’s not just my opinion, but what her gut is telling her.
* * * * * Travis, please don’t confuse us creating issues with you being made aware of issues. A lot came to the surface that already existed. She simply realized that the things that were bothering her were real problems. They are – huge problems. Things you are doing are causing her a great deal of pain and confusion. We know you and know that in the past you have done this, and were currently doing it to her. This is what so hard for her – the reality of what she had been wondering about. We validated her pain. I think more damage would have been done had I said, “It’s fine the way things are, don’t expect Travis to change. Don’t expect Travis to treat you with respect. This is all he has to offer,” No. You shouldn’t be treating her how you are, and she needs to move on if you aren’t gonna change (she didn’t feel like she could ask youto change). Ya, know when you said I asked her what she would change about me, and she said nothing.” and how that bothered you? And I said, “Maybe she’s just too nice to say, and doesn’t want to upset you.” Well, she is too nice. Travis, something you have in Jodi, that is rare, is that she love you for your potential. None of us are perfect, and it bugged you that you thought, she thought, you were … Great news – she doesn’t think you are perfect, but loves you anyway! When she said she hasn’t experienced the severity of them yet, I am pretty sure she was talking about the possibility of you breaking her heart even more than what you are capable of now.
* * * * * I’m sure you hated us! But only because you weren’t there. All the information at once, delivered as a list, I’m sure was pretty harsh, our advice was per issue she was having, and our concern of what could happen if she didn’t move on, and continued to put up with this painfull situation. This may sound harsh, but we don’t make her feel like crap – you do. She was expressing pain and confusion before we even had a chance to share our thoughts. She was telling us how she feels confused and sad. We validated what “her gut” was telling her – SOMETHING IS NOT RIGHT! You will ruin your own chances unless you treat her how she deserves to be treated, and by that I mean treating her with respect. Don’t make out with her, even though she will want to, unless you are going to commit to her. Because it will only confuse her and cause her more heartache. She’s not falling in love with you, she in IN LOVE with you! And you love someone else, but make out with her, that hurts her. At our age, you make out with a girlfriend, but she’s not your girlfriend. Be her friend until you can give her the rest, versus just giving her the physical until you can give her more. If you just give her the physical without commitment, it is using her, and is disrespectful. And you will hurt her more.
* * * * * I told her to go out and have fun. Like Travis, but don’t sit around and wait for him. Go out with other guys, so WHEN and IF Travis becomes available, you know you want him, and he will know you want him. Good thing your only requirement for dating/making out was HOT, cuz otherwise Jodi wouldn’t be a member. It’s called flirt to convert, it’s practically church policy. Dude, you just need to admit you are jealous of John! Is it because he is making a movie and that is cool? She is not even interested in him! He is just nice! The only way to share the Gospel with non-members is to hang out with them. He has made the comment to her that his lifestyle isn’t that different, he just drinks. Asking if she would leave the church for him is HARDLY anti-Mormon! If you were dating a catholic and she said it was important to her, and you asked would you leave it for me? That does not make you anti-Catholic! You’re jealous, and this is the only thing in your whole letter that I laughed at! I told her he looks like he would make a nice Mormon boy. And that would make you mad because that would make him a threat! Travis, she is whooped on you. Hanging out with John won’t change that. I really do think she should date, for both your sakes. It would also give you time to get over Deanna.
* * * * * I really feel had you been a fly on the wall, you would have been hurt by what was said by all of us, but for the most part, would not have felt that we betrayed your friendship. It killed her to know that her concerns were real. Her best friend had told her that they were, but since we knew you, I think she had hoped we would have told her everything is great, and he loves you more than anything. But we couldn’t because although you may say you care for her, your actions do not reflect this. This is not say you are a terrible person, in fact, you could be much , much worse, but you could be much, much better – as we all could. The tough part is that you are not over Deanna, and cannot give Jodi what she wants/deserves, and even though you have been honest with her it still hurts her. You go through the actions of an available person, as far as the physical goes, which allowed Jodi to fall in love with you, not knowing there was a huge road block ahead. She would go through pain if she tried to move on now, but I fear that she will experience worse pain if she stays close to you as you go through getting over Deanna. My advice to move on came partially because of this (and when I say move-on I’m pretty sure she understood have contact with Travis, but don’t be all about Travis, have fun without guilt). It is going to be hard to be as honest with Jodi as you should be, being as close as you two currently are, as far as Deanna goes. It would be really tough to be in love with someone and watch them struggling to get over someone else. She will be plagued with insecurity, “Will he ever love me that much?” “Why can’t I be enough to help him get over her. “ Etc. and it will follow her into marriage (my sister has gone through this). If you two do work out, you will want Deanna to be as little a part of your marriage as possible , and the more Jodi is included in the process, the more Deanna will be a part of both of your lives forever. It’s a tough situation. She will say she wants to hear about it, and wants to know how you are doing, and will want to be there for you (I am sure she has told you this) but I saw her face when you said you love Deanna. I was upset when Jodi was explaining her concerns, hurt, and disappointments because I thought you had changed. I thought you wanted to do the right thing. You can’t get involved with someone until you are available. It’s not fair to them. I know I am the last person you want advice from, but I am going to give it anyway. You need to pray like you’ve never prayed, and fast like you’ve never fasted so that you can get over Deanna if that is what you have decided to do. I know you say it is all about your concern for Deanna, but I think you are having a hard time letting go too. It will be hard for you to know that Deanna is looking for/has found someone. You can’t take 100% responsibility for Deanna’s situation. She has, and always has had her free agency. You can’t keep beating yourself up over it, let her go! The Lord either loves us, or he doesn’t, and I say HE does. HE will take care of Deanna. She is not your responsibility. She can be happy if she chooses to be, and so can you. You just have to make that choice. Forgive yourself for “holding Deanna back” and have faith that the Lord will take care of her, because He will! Deanna is a great girl, and she will find a great guy, and you need to be ok with that! * * * * * Trav, I love you and want you to be happy. To summarize my advice to Jodi, I was, “Move on. Travis will either fix his situation, be the man you need him to be, and come for you, or he will never let go of Deanna. Either way, if you allow yourself to move on, you won’t hurt anymore than you do now. But if things stay the way they are you could not get really hurt.” Was I telling her you were a jerk? Yes. Because I thought/think you are for leading her on when you weren’t available. That doesn’t mean I don’t love ya, just think you’re a jerk in this area. I’m a jerk in a lot of areas. Like when you called cuz you were hurt and I bit your head off.
* * * * * I have nothing to say about this. Unless this really isn’t your name, then I may have issues
P.S. After I wrote this I slept on it reread it and edited it and describe how I felt when I wasn’t angry. So please take this in the spirit it was sent. I love you both very much.
* * * * * Dude, you were right in your other email. We should have just said, you should talk Travis about these issues. But due to a pattern, we thought we were trying to help her and you, in case there could be a future. I’m really bummed that this hurt our friendship, but glad that you two were able to talk about things that otherwise wouldn’t have come up. I am sorry we didn’t handle it better. I have gained a ton of respect for you – a ton. I would be irate (and I am sure you were) had I thought it went down how I think you do, but I would not have been ok with any of it, under circumstance, and would not have cared what your reasoning was. I guess you are much more mature and humble than I am – which is embarrassing. You are very forgiving, which makes me feel SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO much worse about the whole thing. You have been a great example to me. Thank you for your friendship. I wished you could replay the whole thing to see it was more sad than attacking. There is so much more to say, but I have neglected my family all day. Chris needs his butt wiped, and the kids need their feet rubbed … strike that, reverse it.
I hope you can forgive me, I am truly sorry for any pain this caused you and Jodi.
From: C.S. Hughes
To: Travis Alexander
Date Wed, 31 Jan 2007
Sorry I missed you today when you called. I was at the grocery store. I have felt very awkward about talking to you on the phone, for several reasons, and really wanted the opportunity to put all of my thoughts on paper, so as to get my thoughts straight ..
Let me give you another apology T. I feel like Sky and I are digging in deeper and deeper. I read her emails that she wrote to you and we both agreed it lacked the humility that would be appropriate for this situation. As well, my voicemail to you today, was not appropriate in spirit. It too lacked humility. We both feel like we have or had our reasons for saying all that we did, some of which I will spell out below, but that is beside the point. The point is, as the topic of your email indicated, we crossed the line, and justified or not, appropriate or not, we did cross the line. And T, I am so, so, so sorry. You are one of my best friends in life and I love you like a brother and I am so, so sorry. That is what needs to be expressed more than anything else.
I don’t know that any of this matters. But I want to share with you the frame in which what I sahred with Jodi was shared. I am not asking you to dismiss what I did. I want for you to simply see what I see, and see if you wouldn’t have responded the same way under a similar set of circumstances.
First of all lets look at what I know about the T and his lady situation. And know that this is not being critical, its just stating the facts.
*In the 5 years I have known you, you have never committed to one woman, yet you have had dozens of woman who would have loved just that.
*In those 5 years, the one constant has been Deanna. But she has been in a constant state of I don’t even know what since I have known her. I have heard you tell her you love her on many occasions, yet there is no commitment, yet the relationship, whatever it is, continues.
*Dude, again, not being critical, but you are the biggest flirt this side of the Mississippi. I don’t know anyone else that trumps your flirting ability. You say it yourself, “The T-dogg pulls chicks.” And you do. I have never before gotten involved in your love life, but it has both saddened me and concerned me how you have hooked up with the ladies and gotten into their hearts only to prove disinterested in the end. But this is none of my business. So I never said anything, I just laughed because the emotional turmoil these girls go through aside, it is kind of funny. : )
And you add all of this to the fact that the last time you and I spoke, and I asked you why you didn’t like Jodi, your response was, “I don’t know, it’s just not there.”
So this was the context that our conversation with Jodi was held. I just thought she was another girl on your speed dial. I had no idea your feelings for her ran so deep. None of what I did was justified, but had I known you were seriously interested in her, I would have never said the things I said. I really, really believed that she was your next victim and for her benefit and yours, I was doing all that I could to get her to move on. I really like you and I really like her, and to my knowledge you weren’t into her, so I was trying to do her a favor and you too for that matter. But it looks like all I have doneI put my shoes in my mouth and out my butt and back into my mouth again.
So anyway, in the context above is how I approached this conversation with Jodi. But you must know Travis, this was not a BASH TRAVIS session. This was a conversation where Jodi was sharing her concerns one after another with us. All of what she was telling us added to the bullets above made for what I thought was very obvious …. Travis DEFINITELY does not like this chick!! With what she was telling us, I thought for sure you didn’t like her.
She told us ….
*how you had called her names but said just kidding
*You never call her until very late at night and not every day
*You tell her she can date other guys
*You kiss her, but don’t let it be “public” knowledge
*You pulled down her pics of you and her on <MySpace> (I read your reply to this. Im just giving you the list she gave us)
*She is number two on your my space page, second to Deanna
*And much much more.
Then you add that to the fact that Deanna is still your number one, yet you make out with Jodi.
And add that to the fact that while you were here at my house and on the way up you had spoken to several other girls, including the one in Utah you showed me the picture of.
T-dogg, you add all that up … and what would you think? My thoughts were that this was just another girl that you were playing with and who would end up heart broken like so many others. For example … Brandi. She was another girl that you called to flirt with recently. She was going to NY with friends. You call her in the middle of the night and talk her into going to Sup Saturday which she did, and you didn’t even throw her a bone. Now that’s funny and all, until that girl is sitting in your living room confused as all hell, pouring her heart out to you, expressing her love for the guy who when you add it all up, in m mind anyway, couldn’t give a rat’s about her. Now I have since learned that you do give a rat’s about Jodi, but with all that you had given us, I had no way to tell. So yes, I did tell her to get out quick. We did cross the line. I don’t know why I did it. I’ve never done it before, with all the girls you’ve left spell bound and depressed, why now? I guess because she was here in my home. I could look in her eyes, and see perfect love for you mixed with pain and confusion. I guess I just snapped.
Again, I’m not saying what I did was right. I say what I say simply for you to see where I was coming from. You have to remember, you are my friend, and have been for years. I know the good T as well as the bad T, and you know me. So I have seen a lot of gals get gutted in your wake. Again, I AM NOT BEING CRITICAL. I have done my fair share of gutting. I really, really, really was convinced that with all the “evidence” Jodi was just another number for you. But I was wrong. But, I didn’t have much to work with either.
So I hope you can see, crossed the line …. Yes. Malicious, hateful or spiteful ….. no.
Let me address your other concerns.
Also, I know the “A” word was used (abusive) which is a strong word by the way. I think what you term rough around the edges Sky and I would term abusive. So it’s just a terminology thing, but abusive is probably not the best word. Lets just say rough around the edges. You know you are rough around the edges. I know it, Sky knows it and Jodi knows it. Anyone who knows the T-dogg knows he is rough around the edges. That’s part of why we love you. So, though the a word got thrown in, I think you know what we are talking about. It was all in context and you would concur with what was said, we just used too strong of a word to describe it. I will make this and as much else as I can right with Jodi. I just wish the T-dogg wasn’t so secretive about his feelings for his lady loves … a lot of this could have been avoided, but I am not blaming. I take full responsibility for my actions and again, hope that in light of all of this, you can find a way to forgive me.
As for the Jason Rae thing, that does not apply. Jason Rae thinks we are going to hell. I would not not want to be friends with you because of how you treat your woman, be it great or not so great. That has nothing to do with our friendship. I love you as much today as I always have even though I have silently disapproved of some of the things I have observed in your love life, as I am sure you silently disapprove of some of what I do. That’s called a friend. Friends are the people who know all about you and still love you. I know if you weren’t really my friend, you would have been gone a long time ago with all of my imperfections.
As for calling Jodi Deanna, this was done in fun, but in poor taste. I certainly owe Jodi an apology was well. Again, when all of the above is taken into consideration, that I didn’t think you liked her any more than any other girl in your life. I was doing all that I could to to get her to see she was wasting her time with you. I tried to get her to see how you had not committed to Deanna, yet she is still right there in your life. I was telling her I didn’t want her to end up like Deanna. In love, yet alone … after years and years. So, this was in poor taste. I love Deanna and are as sad for her as I thought I was for Jodi. I thought we were all having fun, everyone was laughing, but evidently I caused pain. I would however like to suggest that perhaps one of the reasons she cried while she shared this with you, is because she does like you so much, and does not want to end up liking you for years in vain. But I was not there, so I wouldn’t know.
I just think this is mostly a HUGE MISUNDERSTANDING. You are approaching this from a “I really like this girl, and could possibly marry her, and two of my best friends are trying to ruin my life and my good name.”
I approached this from, “Travis obviously don’t like this chick. Let me see if I can save them both some time and headache.”
When I look at this through your eyes, it’s shameful. When I look at it through my eyes, it makes much more sense. But in the end, we own you an apology. I personally owe you an apology. I crossed the line, well intentioned or not, the line got crossed and I am sorry. I felt so sorry for Jodi thinking you were about to gut her, I was trying to salvage her. But I was wrong in doing so, and wish I would have kept my trap shut and not got involved at all.
I really do hope you can forgive me Travis.
From: Travis Alexander
To: C.S. Hughes
Date Wed, 31 Jan 2007 3:06 pm
Well said. I will start at the end. You are already forgiven. This is how I saw things going and I appreciate you doing what was right. This email you wrote was the one I was hoping for. I wrote Sky earlier and told her that I knew you’re intentions, you’re reasons combined with your perspective makes since. I obviously didn’t like it, but I understood it, and did from the beginning. I knew you weren’t out to get me. Honestly, most of my passion over it came from the same source yours did ironic as it is. It broke my heart to hear sweet Jodi crying over the week and experience. Just like she is with me, she doesn’t want to upset you and sky. She was in an environment that allowed her to easily vent on me and she did, and then I don’t think she was prepared for the response with such severe actions, but took it silently just as she has with me. Then just as she did with you she came to me crying, and just as you did with her, I got upset. I wasn’t upset about the loyalty issue or anything like that. She is a person with feelings and a heart just like me and she was vulnerable and still is. Let me come clean about where I am at. 7 years of loving someone and wanting it to work and watching it not because of me is hard in itself, but in addition to that I have took the like of someone and not only gutted them but took the best 7 years of her life and let her waste it on me. She could have got married 100 different times but she didn’t because of me. Now because of her age and the dynamics in the church her chances of having marriage to the type of person she deserves has been so greatly diminished that I can hardly live with my self. What if she lives a life with no love, with no family or even worse is forced to marry a piece of crap because of me. It is more than I can bare, she doesn’t deserve it. With people like Brandy I am a bit of a sociopath , and she’ll be fine and move on so I don’t lose allot of sleep over it, but what I have done to Deanna is unpardonable. I have felt over the past couple of years that I am her only shot of her getting the life that she deserves but my “block” concerning marrying her has not gone away, and I have only made matters that much worse. In the past year we have went from boyfriend girlfriend to close friends to friends to aquaintances to only speaking when it is absolutely necessary, like she owes me money type stuff which is about 5 minutes every week and a half or so. I still love her, in some way probably always will but for sure will always hurt for her and feel guilty. I have truly hurt her and near destroyed the one I loved the most. I don’t know what to do. I am good at finding solutions but I haven’t found one for this. I know she is in pain right now. When she calls I cat like I don’t care , and am very surfaced with her. I can tell it tears her apart and it’s all I can do to not cry on the phone. There is 2 reasons I do this, the first is for her. I hate to hurt her and in the process it hurts me but I know it’s even worse to lead her on so the best I can do is act like a kind acquaintance. She hasn’t said it in a while but when she says I love you on the phone I haven’t built the courage to diss her on that. Fortunately she hasn’t done that in a while. This is what I believe Sky is referring to as unavailable and she is right. 7 years I have known her, many of those years I was either certain I would marry her or atleast thought I would eventually come around. We are so close that 2 halloweens ago we played the Newlywed game with a bunch of prepaid legal associates that had been married 2 to 5 years and we won the game easily. I feel like I divorced some one that I still loved and had no big problems with. Someone I have tons of fun with, someone I was happy with, in fact someone I know I would be happy with forever. It is a unique and tortuous experience to dissolve things and I am solely to blame. Now to Jodi. I have always liked Jodi. She looks good on paper. In fact to be shallow she looks good period. But we both know there is a lot more to her. She is amazing. It is not hard to see that who ever scores Jodi whether it be me or someone else is gonna win the wife lotto. I have not let myself get too emotionally attached, because I respected her more than the others, but me not getting emotionally attached didn’t stop her from getting that way. Well having Jodi adore you for any period of time is hard to resist. It wasn’t until after I had an awakening while dating that one girl that 86ed me that I had a paradigm shift. I told her to not expect a lot from me but she continued to pursue me and honestly I have let the walls down a little. Simultaneously I have been going through this extremely hurtful experience with Deanna. But the more I have been able to separate myself from Deanna the more room I have been able to give of myself to Jodi. Now I am far from where I need to be for Jodi and that has everything to do with the Deanna thing and that is killing me. But I have made progress and I hope that progress continues. Hoever I still don’t think it’s fair to Jodi to wait around for me even though it’s only been 4 months. I have encouraged her to go date other members to insure that she is not in love with what I have done for her (aka share with her the gospel) instead of being in love with me. Lets face it any other guy she dates is going to be drastically different then me. Which will either be good or bad. How ever the Jack Ass non member who asked her to toss the church and the 45 year old bald Jew are not my idea of eligible bachelors. I didn’t like the associations or their approach and so I was about as forth right about those guys as you were about me. Honestly though I wasn’t jealous. I would be plenty jealous of a good mormon boy because they have potential of taking her away but I don’t deserve to have my cake and eat it too. Which is a hard pill to swallow and uncharacteristically unselfish of me. The fact that I have real feelings for her and have made some progress is both scary and stressful for me but progress none the less. So when she called me no longer sounding like loving Jodi but like a crying sad version of Sky. I guess the timing couldn’t have been worse, and I was exponentially upset. Jodi has got a major timid streak in her and some time her loving ways are so extreme that she walks on her toes with everyone when she could just have talked things out with me, and because she didn’t tell me she told you and when she didn’t get the advice she was hoping for rather than tell you she came back to me. I have kindly told her, and let me emphasize kindly that she could express any of her feelings or concerns she has for me you or Sky with who it is relevant to. She is genuinely concerned by something that was said that neither of you would have respect for her if she spoke to me, which put her in what she felt was the pickle of a lifetime. I think she feels better about that now and I have been 100% honest about the Deanna thing with her and have also tried to work on her issues with me and she promised she would be upfront and honest with me if she has an issue or feels like she is a victim of the T-Dogg. That is the best I got for her right now, with the desire to be more available. This the farthest Ive come in many years and its still far from where I need to be and I can’t promise anyone anything except I am trying. It’s probably not the best effort, but relative to me it’s pretty good. That’s where I am now. Time will tell. If you want to recommend A good guy to her, be my guest. It will suck but maybe its for the best. I don’t know if that means I am sending mixed singles but what I mean it to be is if I am not ready to marry her than she should be entitled to find someone that is. I am not the best guy in the world. I am D-head with some pretty awesome redeeming qualities. I don’t know if that qualifies as a great catch or not. But once I get married or at least am at that point I think I will be a much better catch. That’s all I got for you. Good or bad that’s where I am at. I am not saying that is good. I am not saying that is good enough for Jodi, in fact it probably isn’t but that’s here I am at. I will finish where I began. There is no love lost. None Zip, zilch, Nada. Honestly it’s the kindest email chat we ever had. = ) Which in my opinion shows that our friendship has gottem even stronger. You said what I deemed inappropriate, I told you. You responded apologetically and explained your motive, it made since, I explained where I am and accept your apology. In my opinion thats the end of it. Just makde sure that Jodi feels comfortable around you guys. I don’t think it will be hard. Talk to you soon.